Curse

Vaal 84 · Nov 15, 2007, 12:30 PM // 12:30

/signed i hardly ever play my necro since this whole mess started.

Friday · Nov 15, 2007, 12:31 PM // 12:31

Just edited my previous post to respond to Ursanway.

Necrotic · Nov 15, 2007, 01:17 PM // 13:17

Whoah! You quoted me.....I'm flattered....and a bit embarassed. Okay maybe not really embarassed but thankyou anyway.

Now for those of you who still don't understand necromancers or their abilities and limitations:

Soul Reaping IS our energy management!!! Maybe some of you have forgotten or you just don't play with your necro enough to actually know this...and believe me...to those of us who have a necro as our primary character...you stick out like a Monk in group of Warriors.

I keep reading about how necros should bring energy management skills like (and I just love this) Signet of Lost Souls. Excellent suggestion....wonderful in fact....unless you don't have the Nightfall campaign.

So tell me....how is a Prophecies necromancer supposed to manage their energy now? Especially with wammos who think they are invincable in the PUG. Heck...sometimes even Guildies can be in a rush and outpace your e regen.

Use Consume Corpse? Okay...yeah so you have one way of getting energy....assuming you are either running a MM build or have enough points to allocate to Death magic. Still...let's consider the newbie Prophecies necro who doesn't yet realize the need for e-management yet finds their blue bar running dry before the whole group of foes has been targeted...let alone killed. Maybe they run a Curses/Blood build to do as much as they can to help kill things faster. Think they are going to have any points left for death, they barely have any for soul reaping. And what about foes who don't leave a corpse?

Add: Remember that in Prophecies you don't get elites until you get to the desert....so many of the truly effectives skills aren't available to the lower level necro to help out with energy cost. Nearly 65% of the game is played with no elites.

Anyway.....in case it wasn't clear....I want Soul Reaping to return to the way it was ...no energy from spirits (it just makes sense...they were already dead) and no timer regulating flow.

~Cin

Frogtree · Nov 15, 2007, 01:24 PM // 13:24

/Signed Please remove the timer. It was put in place to stop PVP problems not PVE.

DreamRunner · Nov 15, 2007, 02:14 PM // 14:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Necrotic

Whoah! You quoted me.....I'm flattered....and a bit embarassed. Okay maybe not really embarassed but thankyou anyway.

Now for those of you who still don't understand necromancers or their abilities and limitations:

Soul Reaping IS our energy management!!! Maybe some of you have forgotten or you just don't play with your necro enough to actually know this...and believe me...to those of us who have a necro as our primary character...you stick out like a Monk in group of Warriors.

I keep reading about how necros should bring energy management skills like (and I just love this) Signet of Lost Souls. Excellent suggestion....wonderful in fact....unless you don't have the Nightfall campaign.

So tell me....how is a Prophecies necromancer supposed to manage their energy now? Especially with wammos who think they are invincable in the PUG. Heck...sometimes even Guildies can be in a rush and outpace your e regen.

If you can't get signet of lost souls, why dont you just use glyph of lesser energy?

Sleeper Service · Nov 15, 2007, 02:30 PM // 14:30

never had a problem with E management playing necro (when maxing out points in SR)...there IS however a problem in the lack of available skills in the SR line.

the thing being, i would not be maxing out points in SR if energy gain was consistent. I dunno how it is for others but thats my personal take.

Divinus Stella · Nov 15, 2007, 02:45 PM // 14:45

Hope it stays, its pretty strong already, i dont really wanna see it go back to being completely overpowered.

Necrotic · Nov 15, 2007, 02:48 PM // 14:48

Dreamrunner: Yeah....that works as long as you're an Elementalist secondary. The point (that you apparently missed) is that a necro's method of energy management is to make sure things die. When things die...they gain energy to keep killing. Most other caster classes get some skills that gain energy or help maintain it even in Prophecies alone. Core skills.

And just for the record...I started as a N/E and once I got it...I used GoLE...but back then it simply had a time duration of use....which was dependant on your ES attribute level if I remember correctly.

Sleeper Service: Exactly.

cthulhu reborn · Nov 15, 2007, 02:57 PM // 14:57

I think that people who don't get why people complain about the soul reaping nerfs are missing the point of the complaint.

The complaint, generally, is not that necro's don't get enough energy since the nerf but rather that the way it works now is preposterous.

The idea that you can gain the energy up to 3 times every 15 seconds except it doesn't count when you have full energy is a stupid mechanism.

I agree that the necro didn't need to get as much energy as it did before. But HOW they solved is stupid. Any other primary attribute has a consistent trigger and soul reaping used to aswell. Example: strength adds AP each time an attack skill is used, energy storage gives +3 energy for each point.
Basically you know exactly what is happening and when.
Soul reaping, well you only get it 3 times every 15 secs, you got to keep a timer to that and watch you energy. It is silly.

Limiting the energy output of soul reaping was quickly a non issue...they way they achieved it is still an issue.
I proposed things such as not getting any or very little energy from raised creatures and spirits. I proposed less energy per kill ( example 1point per 3-5 points in soul reaping) or a combination thereof.
Of course I was not the only one proposing these things. Why? Because less energy gain was fine but we just wanted something that has a consistent trigger without timers. That's all.

Corpselooter · Nov 15, 2007, 03:00 PM // 15:00

Change it, end of story.

DarkGanni · Nov 15, 2007, 07:09 PM // 19:09

Time to remove the timer it only hurts the necros energy management more now that spirits no longer give energy.

/signed

Vinraith · Nov 15, 2007, 07:11 PM // 19:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sleeper Service

never had a problem with E management playing necro (when maxing out points in SR)...there IS however a problem in the lack of available skills in the SR line.

the thing being, i would not be maxing out points in SR if energy gain was consistent. I dunno how it is for others but thats my personal take.

Agreed 100% down the line.

Lets Get to Healing · Nov 15, 2007, 08:27 PM // 20:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Necrotic

Use Soul Feast? Okay...yeah so you have one way of getting energy....assuming you are either running a MM build or have enough points to allocate to Death magic. Still...let's consider the newbie Prophecies necro who doesn't yet realize the need for e-management yet finds their blue bar running dry before the whole group of foes has been targeted...let alone killed. any for soul reaping.

Anyone suggesting to use Soul Feast as e managment has never played a Necro: Soul Feast only yields health, I think. Consume Corpse on the other hand . .

Šiljo · Nov 15, 2007, 08:31 PM // 20:31

its was only overpowered for N/Rts...
i didnt see any1 complaining for the first year and a half....

Friday · Nov 15, 2007, 08:36 PM // 20:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divinus Stella

Hope it stays, its pretty strong already, i dont really wanna see it go back to being completely overpowered.

Why don't YOU just lower the number of points YOU have in SR when you play if YOU feel YOUR SR is overpowered.

PvE balance CANNOT be taken seriously with the skills now available. Enough already with this thing about PvE attributes and skills being "overpowered".

Burning Blade · Nov 15, 2007, 08:44 PM // 20:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ec]-[oMaN

I still can't comprehend how @12 soul reaping 36e return every 15seconds isn't good enough. [email protected] that's 27e every 15seconds. You can't find any better e management in the game that uses no skill slots for the reward.

How about changing SR to like you gain 1 million energy every 10 minutes? You will still go on rampage about how greatest SR is? OMG 1 million e every 10 min or 100K e every 1 min, what profession has more than that?!?!

I hope you now see why people hate this timer so much and want it gone.

/Signed to remove the stupid timer.

as many people have already suggested, make it gain less energy like 1e every 2 ranks in SR. This would solve SR issue for good.

Randvek · Nov 15, 2007, 08:48 PM // 20:48

If the no SR with spirits stays in the game, then /signed, remove the timer. Spiritway is dead, so kill the SR timer.

Chthon · Nov 15, 2007, 08:53 PM // 20:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by fntmx1

If they had any hindsight of the things to come,...

...wouldn't they be walking backwards, bent over, looking between their legs as they went?

I disagree with a lot of what a-net does, but I'm not sure assuming that particular position would be an improvement. Some foresight, on the other hand...

(^Joke. I agree with your sentiment (at least in part), if not your diction.

)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corpselooter

Change it, end of story.

I'm glad you see it as that simple an issue. I see it as that simple too. Timer needs to go. Boom. That's it. That's all there is to it.

However, I've been told that this thread will be booted to Sardelec, where it will wither and die in obscurity, if the posts aren't more than just "/signed" or the equivalent. Please, for the love of your necromancers, post why you think the timer should go (or stay) and also what you think of no-SR-from-spirits and why. Thanks!

Necrotic · Nov 16, 2007, 12:38 AM // 00:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lets Get to Healing

Anyone suggesting to use Soul Feast as e managment has never played a Necro: Soul Feast only yields health, I think. Consume Corpse on the other hand . .

You're right of course....I was half asleep when I responded and I actually meant Consume Corpse.....not Soul Feast.

Edited for clarity

makosi · Nov 16, 2007, 12:54 AM // 00:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divinus Stella

Hope it stays, its pretty strong already, i dont really wanna see it go back to being completely overpowered.

I agree. I can't say I notice much difference between then [pre-timer] and now. I just have to pack GoLE or Signet of Lost Souls. In other words I have to manage energy in the same way as my ele, monk, mes... other characters do.

Even as MM it's not hard on the energy. 15 secs is not long and they reduced minion and minion-maintenance costs.